Thanks so much, Keith. I've heard Byrna advertised so much - and by conservative broadcasters I would normally trust. I'm more and more disappointed how much "money talks" for them also.
I have been teaching church and school defense/security now since 2004 (not long after I came to faith). I am a police veteran with nearly 40 years of experience. I have not "tested" this device as you have but I have in fact voiced my concerns/doubts about this. Well done.
Thanks Keith. I’m disappointed as I saw a niche for this tool. I wouldn’t have ever recommended it as a solution to an armed attacker, but perhaps as a less lethal option to address an elderly person, intoxicated person, child, or otherwise unskilled assailant with a knife or improvised impact weapon. Of course that option would only be available when you have another team member with a firearm on cover . But based on your testing, it appears the Byrna doesn’t have the punch to even function at a minimal level in that role. Disappointing.
Anthony: I understand your belief the Birna will stop an attacker, but I guarantee it absolutely will not. Your family you were trying to protect will be at a funeral…yours!
Hopefully the laws are changing, as a bill to do exactly that has just been passed by the House and then will go to the Senate If passed there, it will then it will go to President Trump for signing, which he has declared he will. As a retired police officer l beg you to not relay on an air pistol to stop a bad guy.
From my reading of LAPD research, Mace or chemical sprays have a 30% failure rate and Tasers have a 45% failure rate. I have read multiple incidents in my town where the less than lethal tools have failed to subdue a perpetrator. If someone is coming at a LEO with a knife or has a gun out 'less than lethal' tools are dropped and the firearm is used. Or one officer is using the less than lethal with another covering with a gun. 'I don't want to kill anyone' is a common line, but with the speed with which an attacker can kill you is factored in, it means that you have to shoot the attacker in order to stop the attack. My Team is so limited that a 'multi layered' approach, as ideal as that sounds, will not work for us.
Great review. Honestly, somewhat expected results. Although I’ve been shooting since age 7 when my Veteran Dad, Vet Uncles and other Veteran family and friends decided it was time to start. And I’ve spent a lifetime now training and adapting with the times.
But to the topic, in my teens and twenty’s, I played a lot of paintball. The sport evolved quick. Many of the tournament guns I still own are used by numerous LEO and others applying pepper balls. But with whip hoses and a large Co2 tank on their back or mounted onto the longer barrel platforms in the stock location.
Now, some still use Co2, but as paintball transitioned to compressed air, that is superior to Co2. You don’t lose pressure as fast like Co2. Co2 will get so icy cold that it will frost up guns and slow the velocity relatively fast. Air doesn’t. BUT getting adapters to fill compressed air from Scuba tanks alone is very expensive. Buying those high psi compressors gets extremely expensive. Plus the air tanks for the guns are larger. And expensive also.
It just doesn’t make it practical at all for any concealed ability. And numerous companies make pepper balls. Some are inferior to others. But some are limited shelf life or they simply turn hard and won’t burst. Too soft and you’ll blast yourself from the ball exploding in the barrel due to not withstanding the pressure.
We’ve had an armed rotating security team at our church for well over a decade now. I aided in training and selecting members that were willing and able to stay calm through simulated stress drills and still maintain accuracy. Everyone without any real world experience will usually fail the first time or 2. But those who adapted and absorbed it, continued to train and improve were the obvious choices. Most realized it wasn’t for them and there were no hard feelings.
I understand the mindset of less lethal. Especially in a house of God. But given my location, we’re fortunate that literally 72% of a 300+ person congregation admitted and showed at church they carried when asked privately. Others likely are also, but understandingly didn’t admit. Even though everyone knew the meetings were private and done by church leaders. I’m usually very private about those things also. But when asked to help, I did as I was led.
We also were fortunate that the church eagerly spent the money for hardened security, cameras, monitors and locking doors that stay locked during church hours. Armed pairs guard all entrances throughout all classes and worship. We simply rotate Sundays and Wednesdays. We only miss a week of class and worship one out of every 6-7 of those rotations.
The front door stays unlocked, but we have a team covering that welcome area as opposed to 2 people. I’m not sure if this is applicable at all to your post or not in all honesty. It just caught my attention and I thought I’d share. Thank you as always for your valuable insight and info. It’s not a topic I take lightly nor should anyone else. God bless. Snake
I would truly appreciate a similar test of the LE model, which is too powerful for the Byrna target trap. The rounds go through like it isn’t even there. Also, while the first puncture-pull is heavy, subsequent trigger pulls proved quite manageable for me, my wife, and our 3 teenage granddaughters.
We had it in our RV. I did see the pepper balls flake and fall apart over time in the box. You have to use or lose. Rotation of ammo is a good idea. Kinetic of course are better.
Thank you for this test and evaluation of the Byrna. As others have suggested, could you do the same with the LE model? I wasn't aware there were different versions. Even it the LE is more reliable the loads would be the same I assume, with the same failure rate.
I am also willing to chip in on the purchase of the LE model, it's unfair to ask you to shoulder the cost of another test tool.
But if I use the different model, as people suggested, the pepper powder would’ve just fallen to the ground the same. When I talk to a Byrna rep it shot show, he was nonchalant about it and said it happens. I have no trust in the product now it doesn’t matter the model. The problem would’ve been the same.
Bear spray is awesome. Strong and has distance. I keep some by the bedside just incase I have to clear a room before entering. I do have a gas mask of my own.
The point about the CO2 pressure degrading after one magazne really stood out to me. If your facing a real thret, you cant afford to have your defensive tool losing efectiveness with each shot. I've seen similar issues with paintball markers using CO2 and its a fundmental design limitation. Do you think a compressed air system would solve some of these reliability concerns?
Keith, what is your opinion on SOK? It is supposed to be "odorless water soluble lubric gel" that is "formulated with ingredients that not only meet the high standard of being on the EPA "Safer Chemical Ingredients List" (SCIL) but nearly all are also listed by the FDA as "Generally Recognized As Safe" (GRAS) food and cosmetic grade ingredients." I know nothing about this product and have no affiliation with the company or anyone selling it.
I have the Byrna CL, which is reportedly more powerful than the SD. I carry it, as a first option tool, and I carry a Sling Bag, which I have my Pistol, and my last option in my vehicle is my AR style rifle; if really necessary. The Byrna works well against Dog attacks while on my daily walks. It’s a great tool; but in a strong threat while at Church; it’s good to know I have the real thing. Thanks for your report & advice. Happy Trails!
Thanks, Keith for actually testing this device. I almost bought one for a week long trip in Colorado for Thanksgiving. I have a CCW in California, it of course it is not accepted in Colorado. Also, my California CCW expired on 11/29. My sheriff is taking 180 days to process CCW renewals so I will be without one now until January 2026. I thought the Byrna may be the only way to go in both cases, but not sure if it s better than nothing?
I know it’s a big ask but I think a review of the JPX OC launcher would be beneficial and have contrasting results to the Byrna review. Several LE departments across the US carry the JPX so I don’t think its a gimmick. I personally like OC but the success of delivery systems varies widely and the reliability of the high velocity primer driven propulsion system of the JPX is worth the money in my humble opinion.
I’ll ask them. I used an FN303 as a cop. The projectiles were shaped like a bullet and it used compressed air. They were much better designed. I want to like these 50 cal ball platforms, they just aren’t performing.
The beauty of the JPX is that it doesn’t fire a projectile, it ‘jets’ a high velocity cloud of OC Gel that disperses like a shotgun blast. That limits the effective range to about 20’ . The other drawback is that it is rounds limited and expensive compared to a can of pepper spray but since it is ins the same price range as the byrna (and it actually works) I think it could be a good recommendation.
Thanks so much, Keith. I've heard Byrna advertised so much - and by conservative broadcasters I would normally trust. I'm more and more disappointed how much "money talks" for them also.
Affiliate money can be a huge source of income when you have a large audience.
I have been teaching church and school defense/security now since 2004 (not long after I came to faith). I am a police veteran with nearly 40 years of experience. I have not "tested" this device as you have but I have in fact voiced my concerns/doubts about this. Well done.
Thanks Keith. I’m disappointed as I saw a niche for this tool. I wouldn’t have ever recommended it as a solution to an armed attacker, but perhaps as a less lethal option to address an elderly person, intoxicated person, child, or otherwise unskilled assailant with a knife or improvised impact weapon. Of course that option would only be available when you have another team member with a firearm on cover . But based on your testing, it appears the Byrna doesn’t have the punch to even function at a minimal level in that role. Disappointing.
John
Anthony: I understand your belief the Birna will stop an attacker, but I guarantee it absolutely will not. Your family you were trying to protect will be at a funeral…yours!
Hopefully the laws are changing, as a bill to do exactly that has just been passed by the House and then will go to the Senate If passed there, it will then it will go to President Trump for signing, which he has declared he will. As a retired police officer l beg you to not relay on an air pistol to stop a bad guy.
May God Bless you.
From my reading of LAPD research, Mace or chemical sprays have a 30% failure rate and Tasers have a 45% failure rate. I have read multiple incidents in my town where the less than lethal tools have failed to subdue a perpetrator. If someone is coming at a LEO with a knife or has a gun out 'less than lethal' tools are dropped and the firearm is used. Or one officer is using the less than lethal with another covering with a gun. 'I don't want to kill anyone' is a common line, but with the speed with which an attacker can kill you is factored in, it means that you have to shoot the attacker in order to stop the attack. My Team is so limited that a 'multi layered' approach, as ideal as that sounds, will not work for us.
Great review. Honestly, somewhat expected results. Although I’ve been shooting since age 7 when my Veteran Dad, Vet Uncles and other Veteran family and friends decided it was time to start. And I’ve spent a lifetime now training and adapting with the times.
But to the topic, in my teens and twenty’s, I played a lot of paintball. The sport evolved quick. Many of the tournament guns I still own are used by numerous LEO and others applying pepper balls. But with whip hoses and a large Co2 tank on their back or mounted onto the longer barrel platforms in the stock location.
Now, some still use Co2, but as paintball transitioned to compressed air, that is superior to Co2. You don’t lose pressure as fast like Co2. Co2 will get so icy cold that it will frost up guns and slow the velocity relatively fast. Air doesn’t. BUT getting adapters to fill compressed air from Scuba tanks alone is very expensive. Buying those high psi compressors gets extremely expensive. Plus the air tanks for the guns are larger. And expensive also.
It just doesn’t make it practical at all for any concealed ability. And numerous companies make pepper balls. Some are inferior to others. But some are limited shelf life or they simply turn hard and won’t burst. Too soft and you’ll blast yourself from the ball exploding in the barrel due to not withstanding the pressure.
We’ve had an armed rotating security team at our church for well over a decade now. I aided in training and selecting members that were willing and able to stay calm through simulated stress drills and still maintain accuracy. Everyone without any real world experience will usually fail the first time or 2. But those who adapted and absorbed it, continued to train and improve were the obvious choices. Most realized it wasn’t for them and there were no hard feelings.
I understand the mindset of less lethal. Especially in a house of God. But given my location, we’re fortunate that literally 72% of a 300+ person congregation admitted and showed at church they carried when asked privately. Others likely are also, but understandingly didn’t admit. Even though everyone knew the meetings were private and done by church leaders. I’m usually very private about those things also. But when asked to help, I did as I was led.
We also were fortunate that the church eagerly spent the money for hardened security, cameras, monitors and locking doors that stay locked during church hours. Armed pairs guard all entrances throughout all classes and worship. We simply rotate Sundays and Wednesdays. We only miss a week of class and worship one out of every 6-7 of those rotations.
The front door stays unlocked, but we have a team covering that welcome area as opposed to 2 people. I’m not sure if this is applicable at all to your post or not in all honesty. It just caught my attention and I thought I’d share. Thank you as always for your valuable insight and info. It’s not a topic I take lightly nor should anyone else. God bless. Snake
I would truly appreciate a similar test of the LE model, which is too powerful for the Byrna target trap. The rounds go through like it isn’t even there. Also, while the first puncture-pull is heavy, subsequent trigger pulls proved quite manageable for me, my wife, and our 3 teenage granddaughters.
We had it in our RV. I did see the pepper balls flake and fall apart over time in the box. You have to use or lose. Rotation of ammo is a good idea. Kinetic of course are better.
These were brand new just shipped when we took the video
Thank you for this test and evaluation of the Byrna. As others have suggested, could you do the same with the LE model? I wasn't aware there were different versions. Even it the LE is more reliable the loads would be the same I assume, with the same failure rate.
I am also willing to chip in on the purchase of the LE model, it's unfair to ask you to shoulder the cost of another test tool.
Have a pleasant Thanksgiving.
But if I use the different model, as people suggested, the pepper powder would’ve just fallen to the ground the same. When I talk to a Byrna rep it shot show, he was nonchalant about it and said it happens. I have no trust in the product now it doesn’t matter the model. The problem would’ve been the same.
Bear spray is awesome. Strong and has distance. I keep some by the bedside just incase I have to clear a room before entering. I do have a gas mask of my own.
The point about the CO2 pressure degrading after one magazne really stood out to me. If your facing a real thret, you cant afford to have your defensive tool losing efectiveness with each shot. I've seen similar issues with paintball markers using CO2 and its a fundmental design limitation. Do you think a compressed air system would solve some of these reliability concerns?
Keith, what is your opinion on SOK? It is supposed to be "odorless water soluble lubric gel" that is "formulated with ingredients that not only meet the high standard of being on the EPA "Safer Chemical Ingredients List" (SCIL) but nearly all are also listed by the FDA as "Generally Recognized As Safe" (GRAS) food and cosmetic grade ingredients." I know nothing about this product and have no affiliation with the company or anyone selling it.
https://www.sokdef.com/
I only know anything based on their material on the web. I would stick to proven products.
I have the Byrna CL, which is reportedly more powerful than the SD. I carry it, as a first option tool, and I carry a Sling Bag, which I have my Pistol, and my last option in my vehicle is my AR style rifle; if really necessary. The Byrna works well against Dog attacks while on my daily walks. It’s a great tool; but in a strong threat while at Church; it’s good to know I have the real thing. Thanks for your report & advice. Happy Trails!
Thanks, Keith for actually testing this device. I almost bought one for a week long trip in Colorado for Thanksgiving. I have a CCW in California, it of course it is not accepted in Colorado. Also, my California CCW expired on 11/29. My sheriff is taking 180 days to process CCW renewals so I will be without one now until January 2026. I thought the Byrna may be the only way to go in both cases, but not sure if it s better than nothing?
I know it’s a big ask but I think a review of the JPX OC launcher would be beneficial and have contrasting results to the Byrna review. Several LE departments across the US carry the JPX so I don’t think its a gimmick. I personally like OC but the success of delivery systems varies widely and the reliability of the high velocity primer driven propulsion system of the JPX is worth the money in my humble opinion.
I’ll ask them. I used an FN303 as a cop. The projectiles were shaped like a bullet and it used compressed air. They were much better designed. I want to like these 50 cal ball platforms, they just aren’t performing.
The beauty of the JPX is that it doesn’t fire a projectile, it ‘jets’ a high velocity cloud of OC Gel that disperses like a shotgun blast. That limits the effective range to about 20’ . The other drawback is that it is rounds limited and expensive compared to a can of pepper spray but since it is ins the same price range as the byrna (and it actually works) I think it could be a good recommendation.
For those of us in California, pepper balls are illegal.